A line I found significant is when Biff says, “Never mind… He wouldn’t listen to you” (120) towards Willy, because just beforehand he was claiming that Willy would be able to reason with his math teacher; however, now that Biff is aware of his father’s affair, all trust for his father is now gone. This fully demonstrates the beginning of Willy and Biff’s frayed relationship, aiding the constant push-and-pull fights that tend to happen between them in present time.
I agree. I think that this event deepens the hostility that we have seen between the boys and Willy from the beginning. Prior to this occurrence, the boys have kind of bit their tongue around Willy, trying not to impose on him or hurt his feelings. However, now they have a strong distrust between them and it only gets worse from here. I think the distrust is further illustrated on page 124 when Biff and Happy are discussing what happened at the restaurant with Linda and Biff says "is that what he told you"-- implying his idea that Willy just lies his way out of things.
I agree that the trust between them is extremely fractured and after this occurrence it seems Willy is in a constant limbo with his children wanting what is best but at the same time giving them reasons to act out against him. This confusion adds even more tension in Willy's personal life and because of the rocky relationship with his kids it is no shock that he questions deep down if they, "always loved me..."(135)The frayed relationship you reference is very clear here because he questions if his own children have love for him and this sense of insecurity with his own family proves to be a deep problem for Willy.
Katalina, I think this is a good point to highlight because now we know the reason behind Biff's animosity towards Willy.
Good connection, Leah, to Biff's comment in the restaurant; I have to agree with the implication there.
What you mention, Mac, that "it seems Willy is in a constant limbo with his children wanting what is best but at the same time giving them reasons to act out against him," I immediately find myself asking: Is Willy a good father?
Charley: “Willy, when’re you gonna realize that them things don't mean anything? You named him Howard, but you can’t sell that. The only thing you got in this world is what you can sell. And the funny thing is that you’re a salesman, and you don’t know that.”(97)
In this scene, Willy asks Charley for money, but still refuses a job to work for him. Then, Willy reveals that he’s even been fired. FInally, Willy gets very in his feelings stating “you end up more dead than alive”(98). This quote appears right in the middle of this scene. Not only does it illustrate Willy’s stubbornness, but also relates back to the idea of failure in the text. Honestly, at this point Willy has lost everything that he believes gives him value. He is no longer able to provide for his family and that makes him a failure. This is shown in his progression from confidence in his “keeping an account”(96) to rather depressive thoughts-- that he’s worth nothing alive now. Charley’s quote is really where this shift in Willy’s attitude is observed because Charley took away the last thing that Willy had-- being a decent salesman. After everything that has happened, I believe that this conversation with Charley is where Willy realizes that (from his perspective) he has very little left and is ultimately what leads to his depressive spiral to suicide.
I agree. The idea that Willy's whole life is based around his being a salesman really lends to the idea that men need something to drive them besides material success. Willy's focused entirely on his job, and his image as a failure/success, and when he loses that, he doesn't know what to do. His already crumbling mind falls even more. I think when Willy says "I always felt that if a man was impressive , and well liked, that nothing--," (97) it really drives home that idea of Willy's total and utter dedication to success, the ultimate cause for the degradation of his mind.
I also agree. I think that Willy has been so completely set in his own pattern of thinking for so long that he doesn't believe he needs anything from someone else. When this proves to fail, Willy doesn't quite want to believe he's lost everything. I completely agree with his depressive spiral down to suicide, and I think that things may have ended differently if Howard hadn't fired him. This really illustrates the heavily underlying theme of failure vs success within the text, and, seeing that he's failed, Willy's biggest disappointment quickly became himself.
I want to bring something else up in regards to Leah's quote of choice -- specifically, this part:
Charley: “Willy, when’re you gonna realize that them things don't mean anything? You named him Howard, but you can’t sell that."
Remember, too, how Willy attributes success to being well-liked and being popular. Part of Willy seems to believe that naming Howard ensures his success. We, however, see the error in this thinking.
“No man only needs a little salary.” -Charley (137)
Charley drives the idea that Willy was too fully dedicated to material success, and that he’d have needed more emotional meaning to ever feel any “enlightenment”. The quote of course covers all men, making it very clear that no man will thrive on material alone. All men need deeper meaning, and unfortunately Willy could never get past his sales roots. He consistently attempted to keep his prideful nature intact, displaying a successful life based on wealth and image alone. However, this pride and need for a positive reputation drove him to his death. That’s not to say Willy’s pride kept up through till the end, as he made a sacrifice for Biff’s business, leaving his life insurance payout. Willy’s last action in life is abandoning his pride and doing something he thinks is noble, giving him one final purpose.
I agree that Willy could not get past his pride and materialism led to his downfall; however, even in his last ditch effort to sacrifice for Biff he still gives him his money instead of actually mending their relationship. The gesture was still based on what Willy believed was the only thing that mattered in life which was money and being able to support oneself. Additionally, Willy thinks 20,000 will make up for the lost love in their life and believes, "he'll worship me for it!" (135) even though his sons just care for what is best for himself. Willy is so wrapped up in financial stability that he loses track of his family and what love is supposed to look like.
Building off of that, I do also believe that Charley has understood that money is not nearly enough to achieve happiness, giving insight towards a new perspective amidst Willy’s beliefs that money is everything. That yes, it may make life easier because things certainly do cost money; however, that is not all everyone needs to live. People need experiences and thrills and all of such that Willy has never encountered before. Instead of understanding that, Willy only shifts the blame of Biff not being successful towards himself, claiming that “Maybe I did something to him. I got nothing to give him” (93), still unable to let go of his materialistic vision.
Excellent insights here! Kobe's quote, "No man only needs a little salary," really gets the heart of what is needed in order to (as Kobe states) "ever feel any 'enlightenment.'"
Mac's point about just giving Biff money "instead of actually mending their relationship" is very valid. For me, this is part of the real tragedy here. This connects well to Katalina's idea that Willy, in the end, is "still unable to let go of his materialistic vision." I think it's completely depressing.
"I say I know who I am! Why can't I say that, Willy" -Biff (132)
In Biff and Willy's final conversation, Biff finally understands what he wants in this world. He discovers his true identity, and he feels confident where his life is headed. Whereas Willy cannot understand his sons newfound confidence, because Willy has never had his own identity. Willy can only amount confidence with material success and the "American Dream". However, Biff realizes that this confidence can free him from his fathers safe expectations set for his son.
I agree. I would like to add on that I think this whole conversation between them is super powerful. Right after Biff says this, it says that Willy "pulls away," then rebuttals "with hatred" and exhibits "an uncontrolled outburst". Willy like, loses control here because, I agree, he cannot fathom Biff actually being more that just *Biff*-- that he could have a meaningful life. I think that Willy is so disappointed in his own life that he expresses his feelings of failure as rage.
I agree that Willy is incapable of thinking of Biff more than the Biff he knows wandering from state to state not making a living. Willy’s defense to Biff breaking him down is that Biff is a “vengeful, spiteful man!” (132) who is there to do nothing but what Willy sees as wrong. This just shows Willy’s immaturity to accept when things don’t go his way, especially when his favorite son is rebelling against him and demeaning all of his hard work.
Excellent job, addressing this important idea of identity, Zoey. I mean... Willy and his sons are completely lost. Willy's idea of what the American Dream encompasses is totally wrong for Willy -- remember, he is good with his hands; he is not good at sales.
The stage directions that you pick up on, Leah, are very telling. It's almost like Willy is hurt by Biff's words; he can't deal with hearing them. We have (ahem... Their Eyes) seen how powerful words can be this semester.
Interesting point about immaturity, Keera. Now that I think about it, I can see this throughout the play in his naivete about what it means to actually become a success.
Willy: “I’m always in a race with the junkyard! I just finished paying for the car and it’s on its last legs…(73) The importance of this quote does not just stem from the fact that Willy is constantly in financial strain, but rather he is constantly trying to tread the waters of life where he is unable to stay afloat. This quote shows that within his life he feels that when he puts out a little fire a bigger one comes right after forcing him to stay on his toes instead of relaxing. It is evident that he feels no satisfaction in his life and the problem is bigger than just the regret in buying the wrong refrigerator, but instead a deep regret that he is not doing enough with his life. In Willy’s eyes there is always something better out there and there is always something he is doing wrong. This constant feeling of being incompetent leads to Willy’s downfall and eventual suicide.
I agree with this completely and would like to add that because of this frustration and hardship that he is going through, Willy sometimes takes his anger out on other people, like his sons for example. He knows first hand how difficult it is to struggle financially which is a big reason why he wants more in life for Biff and Happy. It is why he constantly nags on and pushes Biff to have more motivation to live a successful life and why Willy wants Biff to make good money with his job. Although Willy portrays this "advice" or criticism to Biff in wrongful ways, the underlying reasons for his actions, to him, are reasonable and helpful because he only wants Biff and Happy to have a better and easier life than he has.
I also agree with this insight, indicating Willy’s constant unease. Another example of Willy’s anxiety is when the boys and Willy are having dinner and Biff is trying to tell his story of his meeting with Oliver, however, Willy keeps interrupting, not able to wait for the story to develop. “Willy, as though Biff had been interrupting”(108) indicates how Willy can not even let his own son tell him how his day went. Willy is on so much edge and hoping so badly that one of his boys becomes a success, that he cannot stand one minute without knowing then and there if Biff had gotten the money or not. This also illustrates the strain money has on Willy as all he can think about is money, he can not even have a decent conversation with his own sons without needing to know about their financial situations. Money has gotten into Willy’s head and has driven him crazy.
Mac, your phrase "constantly trying to tread the waters of life" is quite appropriate. He certainly tries; he just doesn't get anywhere. The big question to answer: Why?
Good point, Peyton! What frustrates me here is that I, personally, can understand why Willy does it (like you point out), but buy acting this way (even though he believes he is doing the right thing) he is hurting Biff and Happy. They don't grow up having the appropriate mindset to be successful -- either in Willy's definition of success or in Biff's version of happiness/success.
I think Kaiser's reply can be used as evidence and reasoning to support the idea that money most certainly DOES NOT bring happiness.
“Oh, I’d better hurry. I’ve got to get some seeds. I’ve got to get some seeds, right away. Nothing’s planted. I don’t have a thing in the ground.” -Willy (122)
In this moment Willy has finally realized what he believes to be the one thing he can do to make everything right again. If he dies his family will be better off, however before he does that he needs to plant some seeds. This is because Willy believes he has nothing to show for his life and before he dies he needs to plant something so after his death something will come out of it. Willy feels like his life has been a waste and nothing good has come out of it but if he can put something in the ground at least he can die knowing he has something to physically show the worth of all the work he's done in life. This quote really shows the lowest point for Willy as all he can do now is desperately plant some seeds before he dies and hope they can somehow justify his entire life's worth.
This is a really good point. Willy really does want to leave some sort of impact in any way he can. This idea is carried with Willy throughout the whole text. He wants Biff to succeed because it reflects well on him. Whether it's business or the football game. He wants his boys to thrive, to carry on the Loman name in a triumphant way. If Willy leaves this Earth with nothing, he's an utter failure. But these seeds are his last effort, one final mark on the planet.
Agreed. It's saddening to know that he feels worthless and is never able to realize how much his life was worth, how much he had to show for it. It was only after he died that his livelihood was brought to light. Willy had an entire house to show for his life. 35 years of work put into that house having "put up the garage" (138) and when "he built the extra bathroom" (138). Not only the house, but those within the house. In those 35 years Willy had two sons that grew to be great men respectively. Willy never looked back on everything he did, and in doing so he never really was happy with his life accomplishments. He never recognized his accomplishments and that is the saddest thing ever.
Okay, first off, I LOVE Zach's point that Willy "never recognized his accomplishments" -- so true! He is able to do many things (as Zach points out) which in essence proves Biff's line: "He had the wrong dreams. All, all, wrong" (138).
Good choice of scene, Ben. The seeds scene is sooooo sad. Willy believes he has nothing; he has no legacy, so he needs to create something tangible and permanent (something that he can see because he doesn't see his aforementioned accomplishments).
The seeds, as Kobe mentions, are "his last effort" for "one final mark on the planet." This takes me back to Their Eyes. Remember, Tea Cake dies, but Janie brings back seeds... Essentially, it is implied that he will live on.
A line I found important was on page 95 when Bernard says to Willy "But sometimes, Willy, it's better for a man to walk away." this quote stood out to me the most because not a lot of people in the world today understand this concept, never mind the people of this specific time period. I think it shows that Bernard is well beyond his years, and has gotten to the point in his life that his successes don't overcrowd the way he sees the world. It stands out because in this moment, Willy is offered some very wise words, and looks right past them. Willy is so overly consumed with providing for his family and attempting to be successful that he will lie to his wife and degrade his children. Willy may have also disregarded this advice as a kind of defense mechanism. He sees within his life that he doesn't have much longer, as he continues to get older. At this point, walking away from something, to Willy, could be absolutely detrimental, and he is afraid of what would happen if he did. This is further proven when Charley goes on to offer Willy a job, and Willy outright refuses, even though he's been fired, saying he already has a job and doesn't need another one.
I agree with your elaboration because Willy seemingly has a lot of pride even when life hasn’t looked the best for him; which I am unsure if that is a good or bad thing. Walking away is simply not an option for him, yet he fails to realize that it is not just him in his life. It is about his wife and his two sons, about his home and his car and the refrigerator that doesn’t seem to want to work. For example, when Willy was having a discussion with Howard, he kept pushing his ideologies onto his boss, claiming that “You don’t understand this” (80) even though it was Willy that could not understand. The world works in a very cruel way, and he is not so special as to have everything he desires.
I also agree with this and have some additional input. With walking away, Willy would feel as if he has given up on everything he worked hard for which is the exact opposite of what he tells his boys to do. Willy's entire family knows that he is getting too old and needs help and this is expressed when Biff says, "He had the wrong dreams. All, all, wrong" (138). Willy was so focused on getting money and making something big out of himself that he disregarded his personal and physical needs and basically just let his own body deteriorate. This goes to show how his inflated ego and unwillingness to settle affect his everyday life. Even when people try to offer him help, Willy simply refuses because he believes that he is too good for it and is afraid that if he takes the help, he will be seen as a weak, old man. Therefore, he allows his ego to get in the way of his real needs.
I agree, Willy's focus his entire life was his vision of success. He refused to give up on that dream which could be seen as admirable but at some points it can be better to let go. On the point of his age he definitely knows the end is coming which is why he is struggling so much to have a legacy that he can leave behind. His family, his house, his job. All the things he valued in life he worked hard to obtain their maximum value. He tried to motivate his sons to become ambitious businessmen, he constantly repaired his house to make sure it was in supreme condition, and finally his job. His job was what he valued most and to be fired this suddenly was the cause for his outburst. The most valuable thing in his life was essentially just ripped away from him on the grounds that he was no longer capable. To Willy that was telling him he was already dead.
Katalina, when you state, "The world works in a very cruel way," I am immediately thinking of the article which states society is to blame, that "the societal framework has posit[ed] a wrong." This is Miller's take, of course, however it leaves us to ask if society is truly at fault here.
In a way, I think Peyton's response to the question raised above. Perhaps, Willy's ego gets in the way? Although... one could also argue that his ego IS the product of society.
Mason's reply has me thinking that if ambition and drive to achieve one's dreams is left unchecked, then the individual will ultimately be destroyed.
Going back to Maya's comment... I just want to speak of Bernard for a second. Indeed, it does appear that Bernard is "well beyond his years." How did he get this way? I ask because we see in the text that Willy and Bernard have different perceptions of what leads to success. Does this lend itself to Bernard's success and Willy's lack of success?
I found the quote, “Pop! I’m a dime a dozen, and so are you!” (132) significant because it emphasises Biff’s frustration with Willy’s obsession of him being destined for something greater. Biff knows that he isn’t a great worker, admitting to Willy that he was filled with a high self esteem that he “could never stand taking orders from anybody,” (131) making it impossible to hold a job for long, let alone move up and become the leader. This is the first time Willy has heard this from his son, both of them have always claimed to be doing better than they are. This is all significant because it shows how tired everyone, except Willy, is of keeping up a facade of success. Despite this, Willy is in denial, which only brings more attention to his delusions of what his and his son’s life is. I believe that Willy won’t admit that all of them have failed because his son’s success is the only thing keeping him going. He worked endlessly to teach what, in his eyes, is the best way for his boys to succeed. Now, like most things in his life, his efforts are fruitless and he is left with nothing.
I disagree with this because Biff isn't "successful" in Willy's mind. I think that Willy is feeling fruitless and feels that he has nothing because he spent most of his life trying to teach his sons what success is and how to attain it, and he feels that Biff has thrown that away and gone off on his own. When they got back from the restaurant, Willy was all too willing to let Biff go and do his own thing, as was Linda. I think the hope that Biff would be something greater than Willy thinks he is is what's kept Willy going all these years, but now Willy is starting to see that what he taught isn't what Biff has followed and now has those feelings of worthlessness. I do agree, however, that the family (except Willy) is tired of trying to be something they're not, and tired of always trying to live up to Willy's (in their minds) unreasonably high expectations.
I believe that Willy is in fact tired just as the two brothers are. Biff is the only one to ever come out and tackle the lie he has been creating for the past twenty years or so. Happy continues to lie saying "well, I'm practically [the assistant buyer]" (130) as a way to make his life more successful as it is. Willy is drained. The man has gone insane reliving the past. The past where his son is nothing but potential and could still be a success. Willy cannot handle reality because it isn't what he wanted. For him to face reality would be for him to realize his son is not successful at all.
Maya, you wrote, "I think the hope that Biff would be something greater than Willy thinks he is is what's kept Willy going all these years, but now Willy is starting to see that what he taught isn't what Biff has followed and now has those feelings of worthlessness." With this in mind, isn't it ironic, then, that in the end Willy takes his life believing that Biff will actually do great things?
I have to agree with Zach (amazing, I know! : ) about Willy being just as tired. Early on we see that he is trying to be on the road less because he can't handle the traveling any more.
Keera's quote, "“Pop! I’m a dime a dozen, and so are you!” (132) is important to note. It implies that people don't necessarily leave a significant mark on the world. I think it alludes to the idea that the "little man" is basically swallowed up by the machine that is society -- but that's just an impression that I have -- it doesn't mean you have to have the same takeaway.
Happy: "I'm gonna show you and everybody else that Willy Loman did not die in vain. He had a good dream. It's the only dream you can have--to come out number-one man. He fought it out here, and this is where I'm gonna win it for him" (138-139). I believe that this line shows extreme significance because it represents the unconditional love Happy had for his father. Throughout his life, Willy wanted his sons to love him and be proud of him just as he was of them and this line clarifies that. In both life and death, Happy loved his father no matter what happened between them and no matter what state of consciousness his father was in. To Willy, that was one of the most important things in life and it illustrates a sense of peacefulness for Willy's death. Willy was also worried that no one would remember him, so to relieve this pressure, Happy dedicates his life to fulfilling Willy's dreams and accomplishments.
I agree with this completely, Happy has always been the son to show Willy love and respect. Additionally, from the beginning Happy has always defended his father whenever Biff wouldn't. For example, when Biff claims that his dad mocks him, Happy chimes in saying that "he's not mocking you"(21). Happy has always thought highly of his father despite the circumstances, which made him a more positive character. Biff really never respecting his father made him lack that foundation of feeling "unconditional love". Happy has always showed a sense of pride with Willy being his father, which made Willy have a peaceful death in knowing that one of his sons care.
I also agree with this. Even though both sons are filled with failure versus success, Happy was also the only son who truly defended his father and tried to understand what was going on with him. Though Willy might not deserve that form of respect for how he treated Happy growing up, he still gave him that "unconditional love" that made Willy's death a little easier in the long run.
I agree that Happy is using his devotion to Willy’s ideal life as a way to help him cope with his father’s death. However, it also highlights how obsessed Happy and Willy are with their dream of a perfect salesman’s life. Despite Willy’s final day being the result of a life wasted in a career that got him an inch from nowhere; Happy only being one of two assistants to the assistant, both have ticked themselves into thinking they have greater prospects. Where Biff is the son that saw the failings of his father and tries to grow beyond them; Happy is the son that will happily follow his father’s footsteps off a cliff.
Peyton, you have offered a perspective that I have never considered -- thank you for that! Indeed, his love is "unconditional," as Zoey and Cam both clarified; yet, I still think it's necessary to consider Conner's point. Unconditional love is a beautiful thing, however, I wonder if Happy will then continue Willy's legacy of failure (of course, one would have to believe Willy has failed...)
Willy, anxiously: Oh, I'd better hurry. I’ve got to get some seeds. He starts off to the right. I’ve got to get some seeds, right away. Nothing’s planted. I don’t have a thing in the ground. This quote is significant because it’s the culmination of Willy’s feelings of failure. The seeds represent the inability to prove his worth. Barely being able to afford food from week to week, Willy scrambles to get seeds down in the middle of the night when no sun is around in a desperate attempt to prove that something he worked for had paid off. However since it’s both the middle of the night and in Brooklyn, the seeds do not germinate, further emphasizing Willy’s feelings of failure.
I agree with this completely. By having Willy attempt to plant a garden, show his last attempt to succeed at something during his life. Willy was especially hungry for success when Biff came home with a new found confidence. When Will hears that, he becomes angry, and "with hatred'(132), he attacks Biff. This show how much Biff, is reminded of himself until this moment. Now that his son found his identity and succeed in some degree, Will feels like it is his turn. Willy was initially angry with Biff because he knew that it was impossible to ever feel successful, due to his life being one failure after the other.
I agree with this insight that Will’s feelings of failure are ever present. Furthermore, while Willy is planting seeds Ben comes to him saying insurance fraud is “a cowardly thing”(126), however, this is Willy’s true last stab at “success.” Willy is going so far as to kill himself just to make money for his family. This illustrates the lengths Willy will go to escape the burden of failure. His life has been full of failures, yet he still wants to succeed in some way, and the last way he knows how is to die for his family’s financial needs. This also helps uncover what Willy defines as success. Although he has a loving wife and two sons, he still can not consider himself a success without being wealthy. When talking to Ben about killing himself he says, “It’s twenty thousand on the barrelhead,”(126) depicting that all he cares about is being able to support his family. Willy does not think about the emotional strain it will have on his family, he thinks they all would want him to kill himself for the money, which in itself shows how distant he was with the world all because he never succeeded in his eyes.
I like how you all interpreted the significance of the seeds. When thinking reading about Ben, I had this picture in my head with Ben (depicted as a little devil-type character) whispering in his ear, like his conscience (or, in this case, his subconscious) talking.
During Willy and Charley’s conversation about money, Willy says “Funny, y’know? After all the highways, and the trains, and the appointments, and the years, you end up worth more dead than alive”(98). Willy’s repeated mention of death as well as his attempts at suicide contributes to the overall sense of failure throughout the play. The only way to be successful in Willy’s eyes is to be ‘well liked’; although Willy claims to be well liked, his sales state otherwise. Failure constantly bombards Willy’s life particularly with his job. He insists on not working for Charley to maintain his pride even after he was fired. Willy is unwilling to accept that times change and being ‘well liked’ will not continue to carry him throughout his life. This idea is too difficult for him to come to terms with causing him to take his anger and frustration out on his wife and sons; ultimately leading to his family’s resentment of Willy. Despite his family repetitively advocating for him, Willy is blind to the opportunities he was given and would rather wallow in his own self pity. Later, Biff even states that Willy’s attempts at suicide were “suppose to make me [Biff] sorry for you?”(130) attempting to bring light to the irrationality Willy is swamped with. Moreover, Willy’s self deprecating humor allows for a full view into Willy’s mind and how he is too deep in misery to realize that nearly everyone he knows only wanted to help him. His failure clouded his judgement causing him to believe that all of his actions would sum short of success. This idea, so deeply rooted in his brain, only enhanced his sense of failure and assisted his oversight of the possibility of becoming free.
I agree with your point that Willy is too deep into his self pity to accept any help despite the many offerings. Along with not accepting any help, Will also refuses help from himself. This refusal to take a chance and succeed in anything but sales is shown when Willy is talking to Charley about his roof. He knows he is good with tools but refuses to believe that he could be successful with them because “a man who can’t handle tools is not a man.” (44). Not only does Willy refuse to think that being able to build things should be a common trait about men, but he degrades Charley with it. Acting as if Willy is better than him because he can build a roof. This illustrates that Willy only believes his success is in sales and not in the skills he is actually good at.
I agree, Willy’s belief that he can only attain success through sales creates a tunnel vision of failure in his life. He can’t see the opportunities given to him because he’s so stuck on this and the ideology of needing to be well liked in order to succeed. After being offered a job in Charley’s business, Willy declines by stating “I-I just can’t work for you, Charley.” (97). Willy doesn't understand how Charley can be successful without having the personality that he deems necessary for success. Therefore he can’t see himself being bound to Charley for anything other than those 50 dollars a week. His perspective on success and inability to update it lead him to his death.
I definitely don't disagree any of your connections to Willy's sense of self-pity or debilitating perspective on success -- all are valid points! I am curious, however, if anyone has any empathy or even sympathy for Willy. Should we feel bad for him? (And, this is me legitimately posing a question to think about... I think you could successfully argue either way.)
Biff: “Dad, will you give me a minute to explain?” (108), Biff :“Don’t take it that way! Goddammit!” (113). The whole discussion of Biff’s meeting with Oliver is particularly important because Biff is not given the chance to say what he needs to. He is nervous in trying to break the news to his dad and does not quite know how to do it. When the conversation begins it does not help Biff become more at ease because Willy constantly interrupts him or starts jumping to conclusions. Most of the conclusions he jumps to are bad and he is just assuming at this point that his son will let him down. Therefore, connecting back to the idea of failure. The conversation casts some more light on their father-son dynamic. Biff is constantly trying to please his father with no success. This conversation also shows how Willy and Biff never quite understand each other. There is a lack of communication between them which adds to their damaged relationship.
I agree with your points. I completely understand that this father-son dynamic is very complicated in terms of failure. Without success from his boys, Willy is at a loss because he isn't sure if he raised them properly, so even though he blames the boys on their lack of success, he's ignoring the doubt within himself. This is also shown throughout his conversations with his brother, Ben, as he knows he was not as successful as he thought Ben was at an early age. In a way, Ben was right, stating "You'll never get out of the jungle that way," because if a person is lost in their head with success and failure, it will not end well. His expectations for his sons, therefore, are far too high to reach in comparison to what Ben had accomplished, and he puts his sons down just because he's showing what he doubts within himself. This being an toxic trait, their relationship was bound to be damaged because of their lack of understanding for one another.
I agree with your point. The conflicting thoughts in Biff's mind one hundred percent backup your idea. Biff wants to tell his father that he failed but Happy tries to make him hide it. He tells Biff to lie and “tell him something nice”(105). This conflict of wanting to tell his father but then also feeling the pressure from Happy of how negatively it may affect him really weighs on Biff. With the combination of being interrupted constantly and Happy almost forcing him to keep it to himself Biff is in an impossible situation and like you said it all adds to their damaged relationship.
Yes... lack of communication! That is an astute point, Gio, that I think we could add to our list of big ideas.
This idea of communication can even be connected to Cam's points about Ben. (On a different note, I like the use of "toxic" in your response, Cam!)
To coincide with Ben's points, it's almost like Biff's internal conflict is affecting his ability to communicate effectively (though, of course, Willy and Happy don't make it very easy either...)
When Willy and Biff are having their big argument Biff says "I am not a leader of men, Willy, and neither are you. You were never anything but a hard-working drummer who landed in the ash can like the rest of them!"(132) Biff is calling out his father, who up until now has acted like a big shot, saying that he was known far and wide as a prestigious salesman. Biff recognizes that they are both just cogs in the machine of society and don't play very important roles, that no matter how hard they work they will never reach the top, and at the end of their usefulness they will be cast aside. Biff is accepting his role and trying to move on while Willy is stuck, letting his imagination change the world around him because he cannot change himself.
I agree with you because this is seen as a turning point in both of their perceptions of success. They are beginning to understand that how they perceived success as is utterly flawed. Biff understood that he wasn’t gaining success, so he accepted it and tried to move on to actually become successful, but, like you said, Willy is stuck where he is and continuing to be stubborn. Along with Willy’s stubbornness affecting his success, it also affects his relationships. This is illustrated when he’s having a conversation about being lonely with the woman, when she says, “Whyn’t you have another drink, honey, and stop being so damn self-centered” (116). Being so stubborn is affecting how he performed in his job, but also how others perceive him.
I completely agree with your point and honestly it's quite sad. It is as if Willy is completely aware of the fact that he is not a big shot but despite that he still acts to those around them like he is. He realizes his career has been a bust and in the end he hasn't gotten at all out of it what he thought he would. Willy says to Howard "They don't know me any more"(81). Yet later on when he talking to "Ben" he says "That boy will be thunder-struck, Ben, because he never realized I am known!"(126) In this instance he out loud admits that he's washed down but to himself he can't admit that and still talks himself up in his own mind. With all this being said the sad thing is that despite the fact that deep down Willy knows he is a failure he is unable to admit it to himself or those around him.
Firstly, I want to comment on the power behind Biff's words in Mason's quote of choice. Can you imagine saying something like that?!!!! Ouch. Secondly, I think it is clever to link to "cogs in the machine of society." Within the text there is a consistent implication of this idea.
I appreciate, Sarah and Ben, how you reference Willy's stubbornness; and, agree that it is "quite sad." Hypothetically speaking, I wonder: If he were to have become aware of his errors earlier in life, would he have been able to change? Honestly, I don't even feel comfortable with an answer to that question right now... it's just me thinking!
Willy: … and by the way he died the death of a salesman, in his green velvet slippers… (81)
Dave Singleman’s death illustrates the dream Willy formed his life around. One where when he died, he would be remembered and known and “well liked”. A life where the work was simple, almost comfortable. Willy was sold on a lifestyle that only happens to those who are both hard-working and extraordinarily lucky. This one line depicts the terrible contrast between the idea of the American dream and the reality of it. If this play was on the life and death of Dave Singleman, it would be the story of the man that made his American dream come true and died having been known by people the world over. That was the “Death of a Salesman” that Willy was sold. The death that Willy found himself with, was born from a dream founded on luck, and sold on the empty promise that luck had nothing to do with it.
I agree with your pints because Willy did grasp onto a false hope that he passed down to his children. As Willy grappled with his parenting and questioning his skills as a parent, he was also grappling with what he viewed himself as and what he wanted for himself, and in turn his children. He ultimately wanted success, but he was fed a twisted reality of what the American Dream is in comparison to what is actually feasible. Even Charley says”A salesman is got to dream, boy. It comes with the territory” (138). This exemplifies the understanding that everyone around Willy knows that he has far-fetched dreams in relation to the American Dream, but Willy is so focused on achieving his unrealistic idea of the American Dream he can’t even acknowledge how irrational his focus is.
I agree, Willy is obsessed with how he will be remembered. It's similar to the American Dream but instead of obtaining in the moment Willy desires to have a legacy. This legacy is not only with his reputation but also with his sons, which is why he is so focused on them being successful business people. When Biff tries to find success elsewhere Willy cannot see that as feasible because his whole life he has only been focused on success in business so to him that's the only place where success could be. Dave Singleman, similar to Ben represents everything Willy wants. Dave though, represents what Willy wants in death unlike Ben, who represents what Willy wants in life.
Loving that we get to talk about the title now -- even though I still hate on how titles become lines in books! But, as we know, that's just one of many personal issues on my end! : )
When we look at the title of the text, we can also consider how the "death" of the "salesman" relates to the change within the job itself. The job of salesman, as Willy knows it, has changed. And, we all know how good Willy is with change, right? (sarcastic tone here)
And, of course, the title also refers to Willy's metaphorical and physical death. The beautiful thing (and often most frustrating) is that so many different meanings are implied within just one phrase or word. Remember the poem, "Cross," by Langston Hughes? Cross has multiple denotations and connotations, and Hughes plays upon all of them.
Willy: “Nothing’s planted. I don’t have a thing in the ground” (122).
The garden symbolizes Willy’s career. He doesn’t have anything to show for his career as it was all to keep himself afloat as he went through life, not long term sustenance. This also emphasizes Willy’s materialistic obsessions, with which he associates ones’ success to. The garden has nothing to show for what he may have done in the past to it, thus a parallel to Willy’s career. Willy figuratively planted himself in sales, but never blossomed, like his garden. Wanting to get seeds illustrates Willy’s last desire to have something to show for the hard work he put into life. This illustrates his insecurities as well. At the start of the play, Willy was insecure about his parenting, but eventually this transitioned to insecurity about his lack of tangible sense of image and reputation. Miller used Willy’s self-doubt in his parenting skills to mask his true underlying insecurity: his failure in his job.
I totally agree. In the final few scenes, Willy fumbles around and attempts to "sow the seeds of success" by quite literally sowing seeds in the backyard garden. The seeds' failure to grow quite literally represents Willy's final failure to be a success. Willy not only has to face the failure of his poor performance and work and now his firing, but he also has to deal with the failure to grow these seeds. This inability emphasizes his insecurities that he displaces into Biff.
I agree that the garden is a parallel to Willy’s career. Yet, I also think the garden just parallels Willy himself. He has come to this realization that his life is ending soon and he has nothing to show for it. This is his final shot at being successful and leaving a mark. His prior attempts have come back in his face whether it be his sons or his career. In his mind what does he have to show? He is told by Linda that “nothing’ll grow any more” (72) yet, he is hopeful he can make it work. The fact that nothing will grow also mirrors Willy because he can’t seem to take root when he tries. He attempted to raise a successful family and be extraordinary in his job but it just did not work. This adds to Willy’s insecurity about every aspect of his life. In addition, a garden also emphasizes life and growth whereas, he refutes change and has the inability to keep a life going. He never gets his garden rooted before he dies, so he was never actually settled into his life.
Sarah, I really appreciate your use of word choice: "Willy figuratively planted himself in sales, but never blossomed, like his garden." You extended the metaphor well -- delightful to read!
Making parallels between the garden and Willy AND the garden and Willy's career are also quite valid. Ryan, you also used metaphor appropriately here with the phrase "sow the seeds of success;" and, Gio, expanding the idea of the garden and change is excellent -- love the word choice of "He never gets his garden rooted."
WILLY: When this game is over, Charley, you’ll be laughing out of the other side of your face. (89)
This line is significant because it illustrates the emphasis Willy is putting on Biff’s last game. He believes that this game will secure Biff’s future in football, he even goes so far as to claim that it “is the greatest day of [Biff’s] life.” It is later revealed that “[Biff’s] life ended after that Ebbets Field game” indicating that Willy was correct in saying it will be the greatest day of Biff’s life because after that, his life went downhill. This ties back into the significance of the quote, where Willy is bragging to Charley about his son’s success, but in reality it was the last time Biff would be one which shows how desperately Willy wants one of his sons to “make it” and live a good life unlike the one he has had.
I agree. I think the importance that Willy puts on this game sets his high expectations Willy had for Biff. Willy believes that Biff will go to the best football school in the nation and become the greatest football star the world has ever seen. However, after that game, Biff fails math and is therefore rejected from college. It's the extremely high expectations that Willy puts on Biff that drive the wedge in their relationship. While Willy just wants to see his sons succeed, the bar he sets for them is far too high, resulting in them spiting him for making them feel like failures the way he does.
I agree Willy puts a lot of emphasis on Biff’s last game, but also he emphasizes whatever his son’s are doing. He does this because he wants them to be successful and give him bragging rights. He becomes overly excited at any talk of opportunity. For example Biff’s meeting with Oliver, Willy is happy and mentions how Biff is “heading for a change” (72). However, with his overemphasis comes this very brutal criticism. Whenever his boys come up empty handed, particularly Biff, he becomes enraged. Moreover, when Biff tells him his meeting with Oliver did not go well Willy starts yelling at his son and tells him “If you hadn’t flunked you’d’ve been set by now!” blaming Biff and himself (109). Willy partially blames himself for Biff’s failure and is trying to make up his own failures in life. He does this by living through Biff. Back to the example of the football game, he continually says “it is the greatest day of his life” (89). He is putting a lot of pressure on Biff in this game because this is what is going to make him known. Willy’s prime has already passed and he considers himself a failure because he is not popular. Therefore, this drives Willy to make sure it does not happen again in the form of his sons.
I'd like to add to Kaiser's comment which reads as follows:
"[Willy] believes that this game will secure Biff’s future in football, he even goes so far as to claim that it “is the greatest day of [Biff’s] life.” It is later revealed that “[Biff’s] life ended after that Ebbets Field game” indicating that Willy was correct in saying it will be the greatest day of Biff’s life because after that, his life went downhill."
What frustrates me about this ("this" meaning what occurs in the play) is that Willy's affair is what triggers Biff to change course. Biff was all set to finish the class; but... he doesn't. Enter Willy and the Woman.
Is it Willy's fault? Is it Biff's fault? Who (if anyone) is to blame?
Biff crying,broken: “Will you let me go, for Christ’s sake? Will you take that phony dream and burn it” (133) In the book Willy’s idea of The American Dream is connected with being prosperous through charisma. He believes that his family can achieve it all through this false image that he’s created for him and his sons. It’s gotten to the point where they can’t tell the difference between what actually happened and the lies they have told each other. Act 2 demonstrates the truth about these characters; Happy being one of two assistants to the assistant, Biff’s time in jail over theft, and Willy’s infidelity to Linda, etc. It’s not until Biff reaches “the peak of his fury”(132) that he finally obtains the ability to express himself and his true desires. He doesn’t want to follow his father’s materialistic idea of the American dream. Biff is able to acknowledge and accept the reality of their situation, they’re “a dime a dozen” (132) and no lie can’t prevent that. He seeks freedom from The American Dream and that’s why he’s so set on working in the west.
I agree that at their final two arguments one of the main concerns was how Willy has been lying to himself when it comes to almost every aspect of his life. This wall of illusionary success acting as his only defense against the reality of his families lives. It is most apparent during Willy’s outbursts when discussing the past with Bernard. Willy almost has to place blame for Biff’s apathy on anything other than the truth. He is wholly convinced it was the teacher or it was Biff himself that ruined his future, when it was the environment and the situation that biff found himself in that destroyed his enthusiasm for the future.
I agree that Biff cannot live up to his fathers expectations and that is why he becomes furious however I do not believe it is because he wants to break away from the American Dream; I believe that Biff wants to live his own American Dream. Although not the same as Willy’s, Biff’s dream still maintains the ultimate result of being successful. Willy wants Biff to be successful and Biff wants to be successful but their different views of success is the real problem. Biff’s vision of the American dream involves buying “a ranch”(23) and using “our [Happy and Biff’s] muscles”(23). While Willy’s dream, like America said “ being prosperous through charisma”. These dreams clash, they both want to succeed but their methods of success are the reason for their dispute.
I like your use of the word "charisma," America -- it's the adult version of Willy's "well-liked!" Your points also have me connecting back to Gatsby and his version of reality. Both Willy and Gatsby have issues discerning what is real and what is not.
Notice, as Conner points out, how the past filters into this text as well. Think about it... What might the play being saying about the past? About the future? What happens if we continue to live in the past?
Nice counterpoint, Tiana! You use excellent evidence to support Biff's version of the American Dream. Biff's notion of success is legit to him; but, problematically, as you stated his idea of success "clash[es]" with Willy's idea of success.
I found the part of Act 2 where Biff is crying in front of his father to be very important. Biff’s demanding that Willy let him go conveys Biff’s powerful emotions. Biff doesn’t want his father to believe in him anymore because it is crushing Biff knowing that he is disappointing his father each time he returns to the house. Willy’s optimism that Biff will still be great is too much for Biff. He so desperately wants his father to give up on him so he can finally have that reality check he needs. Biff can’t move past his weaknesses until his father, the one man he loves the most, gives up on him. If Willy gives up, then Biff’s entire life will change.
I disagree that Biff needs Willy to give up on him. Although Biff does ask his father to “let me [Biff] go, for Christ’s sake?” (133), he is upset and impulsive. Biff needs his fathers approval. When Biff first came home him and Happy were conversing about Willy. Happy said that Willy mumbles as if he is “talking to you [Biff]” (21) and Biff twice asks “what’s he say about me?” (21). He is hopeful that it is something positive that encourages him instead of depressing him. Willy is notorious for mocking Biff reminding him that he is not a success but all Biff wants is his fathers acceptance. That is the reason he hides the fact that he went to jail; he was attempting to preserve any last sense of decency his father may think about him. Biff may believe he wants his father to give up on him, but Biff needs this push, this drive, to enforce him to strive to be better. The love Biff has for his father makes him want his father to accept him, and in a time of hurting he claimed otherwise, but his thoughts and actions argue otherwise.
I agree with the importance of Biff’s crying in front of his father to be very important in Act 2 and his failures to be a result of the delusions of grandeur Willy implemented in them. When Biff is at the height of his emotions he begs Willy to “take that phony dream and burn it” (133). He understands that all the lies they told to make themselves look/feel better have given them the inability to distinguish the truth from their lies. The moment he realizes this, he gains the ability to be free from his father’s ideology of success.
Interesting discussion... I am wondering if, rather than give up on him, Biff just needs Willy to finally accept truth/reality...
And, (again, I am just thinking) what exactly are Biff's weaknesses? Part of me thinks that Willy views what Biff is actually good at (the ranch, working with his hands, etc.) as weakness, whereas they are actually strengths.
But, don't get me wrong -- Biff definitely has some faults!
A line I found significant is when Biff says, “Never mind… He wouldn’t listen to you” (120) towards Willy, because just beforehand he was claiming that Willy would be able to reason with his math teacher; however, now that Biff is aware of his father’s affair, all trust for his father is now gone. This fully demonstrates the beginning of Willy and Biff’s frayed relationship, aiding the constant push-and-pull fights that tend to happen between them in present time.
ReplyDeleteI agree. I think that this event deepens the hostility that we have seen between the boys and Willy from the beginning. Prior to this occurrence, the boys have kind of bit their tongue around Willy, trying not to impose on him or hurt his feelings. However, now they have a strong distrust between them and it only gets worse from here. I think the distrust is further illustrated on page 124 when Biff and Happy are discussing what happened at the restaurant with Linda and Biff says "is that what he told you"-- implying his idea that Willy just lies his way out of things.
DeleteI agree that the trust between them is extremely fractured and after this occurrence it seems Willy is in a constant limbo with his children wanting what is best but at the same time giving them reasons to act out against him. This confusion adds even more tension in Willy's personal life and because of the rocky relationship with his kids it is no shock that he questions deep down if they, "always loved me..."(135)The frayed relationship you reference is very clear here because he questions if his own children have love for him and this sense of insecurity with his own family proves to be a deep problem for Willy.
DeleteKatalina, I think this is a good point to highlight because now we know the reason behind Biff's animosity towards Willy.
DeleteGood connection, Leah, to Biff's comment in the restaurant; I have to agree with the implication there.
What you mention, Mac, that "it seems Willy is in a constant limbo with his children wanting what is best but at the same time giving them reasons to act out against him," I immediately find myself asking: Is Willy a good father?
Charley: “Willy, when’re you gonna realize that them things don't mean anything? You named him Howard, but you can’t sell that. The only thing you got in this world is what you can sell. And the funny thing is that you’re a salesman, and you don’t know that.”(97)
ReplyDeleteIn this scene, Willy asks Charley for money, but still refuses a job to work for him. Then, Willy reveals that he’s even been fired. FInally, Willy gets very in his feelings stating “you end up more dead than alive”(98).
This quote appears right in the middle of this scene. Not only does it illustrate Willy’s stubbornness, but also relates back to the idea of failure in the text. Honestly, at this point Willy has lost everything that he believes gives him value. He is no longer able to provide for his family and that makes him a failure. This is shown in his progression from confidence in his “keeping an account”(96) to rather depressive thoughts-- that he’s worth nothing alive now.
Charley’s quote is really where this shift in Willy’s attitude is observed because Charley took away the last thing that Willy had-- being a decent salesman.
After everything that has happened, I believe that this conversation with Charley is where Willy realizes that (from his perspective) he has very little left and is ultimately what leads to his depressive spiral to suicide.
I agree. The idea that Willy's whole life is based around his being a salesman really lends to the idea that men need something to drive them besides material success. Willy's focused entirely on his job, and his image as a failure/success, and when he loses that, he doesn't know what to do. His already crumbling mind falls even more. I think when Willy says "I always felt that if a man was impressive , and well liked, that nothing--," (97) it really drives home that idea of Willy's total and utter dedication to success, the ultimate cause for the degradation of his mind.
DeleteI also agree. I think that Willy has been so completely set in his own pattern of thinking for so long that he doesn't believe he needs anything from someone else. When this proves to fail, Willy doesn't quite want to believe he's lost everything. I completely agree with his depressive spiral down to suicide, and I think that things may have ended differently if Howard hadn't fired him. This really illustrates the heavily underlying theme of failure vs success within the text, and, seeing that he's failed, Willy's biggest disappointment quickly became himself.
DeleteI want to bring something else up in regards to Leah's quote of choice -- specifically, this part:
DeleteCharley: “Willy, when’re you gonna realize that them things don't mean anything? You named him Howard, but you can’t sell that."
Remember, too, how Willy attributes success to being well-liked and being popular. Part of Willy seems to believe that naming Howard ensures his success. We, however, see the error in this thinking.
“No man only needs a little salary.” -Charley (137)
ReplyDeleteCharley drives the idea that Willy was too fully dedicated to material success, and that he’d have needed more emotional meaning to ever feel any “enlightenment”. The quote of course covers all men, making it very clear that no man will thrive on material alone. All men need deeper meaning, and unfortunately Willy could never get past his sales roots. He consistently attempted to keep his prideful nature intact, displaying a successful life based on wealth and image alone. However, this pride and need for a positive reputation drove him to his death. That’s not to say Willy’s pride kept up through till the end, as he made a sacrifice for Biff’s business, leaving his life insurance payout. Willy’s last action in life is abandoning his pride and doing something he thinks is noble, giving him one final purpose.
I agree that Willy could not get past his pride and materialism led to his downfall; however, even in his last ditch effort to sacrifice for Biff he still gives him his money instead of actually mending their relationship. The gesture was still based on what Willy believed was the only thing that mattered in life which was money and being able to support oneself. Additionally, Willy thinks 20,000 will make up for the lost love in their life and believes, "he'll worship me for it!" (135) even though his sons just care for what is best for himself. Willy is so wrapped up in financial stability that he loses track of his family and what love is supposed to look like.
DeleteBuilding off of that, I do also believe that Charley has understood that money is not nearly enough to achieve happiness, giving insight towards a new perspective amidst Willy’s beliefs that money is everything. That yes, it may make life easier because things certainly do cost money; however, that is not all everyone needs to live. People need experiences and thrills and all of such that Willy has never encountered before. Instead of understanding that, Willy only shifts the blame of Biff not being successful towards himself, claiming that “Maybe I did something to him. I got nothing to give him” (93), still unable to let go of his materialistic vision.
DeleteExcellent insights here! Kobe's quote, "No man only needs a little salary," really gets the heart of what is needed in order to (as Kobe states) "ever feel any 'enlightenment.'"
DeleteMac's point about just giving Biff money "instead of actually mending their relationship" is very valid. For me, this is part of the real tragedy here. This connects well to Katalina's idea that Willy, in the end, is "still unable to let go of his materialistic vision." I think it's completely depressing.
"I say I know who I am! Why can't I say that, Willy" -Biff (132)
ReplyDeleteIn Biff and Willy's final conversation, Biff finally understands what he wants in this world. He discovers his true identity, and he feels confident where his life is headed. Whereas Willy cannot understand his sons newfound confidence, because Willy has never had his own identity. Willy can only amount confidence with material success and the "American Dream". However, Biff realizes that this confidence can free him from his fathers safe expectations set for his son.
I agree. I would like to add on that I think this whole conversation between them is super powerful. Right after Biff says this, it says that Willy "pulls away," then rebuttals "with hatred" and exhibits "an uncontrolled outburst". Willy like, loses control here because, I agree, he cannot fathom Biff actually being more that just *Biff*-- that he could have a meaningful life. I think that Willy is so disappointed in his own life that he expresses his feelings of failure as rage.
DeleteI agree that Willy is incapable of thinking of Biff more than the Biff he knows wandering from state to state not making a living. Willy’s defense to Biff breaking him down is that Biff is a “vengeful, spiteful man!” (132) who is there to do nothing but what Willy sees as wrong. This just shows Willy’s immaturity to accept when things don’t go his way, especially when his favorite son is rebelling against him and demeaning all of his hard work.
DeleteExcellent job, addressing this important idea of identity, Zoey. I mean... Willy and his sons are completely lost. Willy's idea of what the American Dream encompasses is totally wrong for Willy -- remember, he is good with his hands; he is not good at sales.
DeleteThe stage directions that you pick up on, Leah, are very telling. It's almost like Willy is hurt by Biff's words; he can't deal with hearing them. We have (ahem... Their Eyes) seen how powerful words can be this semester.
Interesting point about immaturity, Keera. Now that I think about it, I can see this throughout the play in his naivete about what it means to actually become a success.
Willy: “I’m always in a race with the junkyard! I just finished paying for the car and it’s on its last legs…(73)
ReplyDeleteThe importance of this quote does not just stem from the fact that Willy is constantly in financial strain, but rather he is constantly trying to tread the waters of life where he is unable to stay afloat. This quote shows that within his life he feels that when he puts out a little fire a bigger one comes right after forcing him to stay on his toes instead of relaxing. It is evident that he feels no satisfaction in his life and the problem is bigger than just the regret in buying the wrong refrigerator, but instead a deep regret that he is not doing enough with his life. In Willy’s eyes there is always something better out there and there is always something he is doing wrong. This constant feeling of being incompetent leads to Willy’s downfall and eventual suicide.
I agree with this completely and would like to add that because of this frustration and hardship that he is going through, Willy sometimes takes his anger out on other people, like his sons for example. He knows first hand how difficult it is to struggle financially which is a big reason why he wants more in life for Biff and Happy. It is why he constantly nags on and pushes Biff to have more motivation to live a successful life and why Willy wants Biff to make good money with his job. Although Willy portrays this "advice" or criticism to Biff in wrongful ways, the underlying reasons for his actions, to him, are reasonable and helpful because he only wants Biff and Happy to have a better and easier life than he has.
DeleteI also agree with this insight, indicating Willy’s constant unease. Another example of Willy’s anxiety is when the boys and Willy are having dinner and Biff is trying to tell his story of his meeting with Oliver, however, Willy keeps interrupting, not able to wait for the story to develop. “Willy, as though Biff had been interrupting”(108) indicates how Willy can not even let his own son tell him how his day went. Willy is on so much edge and hoping so badly that one of his boys becomes a success, that he cannot stand one minute without knowing then and there if Biff had gotten the money or not. This also illustrates the strain money has on Willy as all he can think about is money, he can not even have a decent conversation with his own sons without needing to know about their financial situations. Money has gotten into Willy’s head and has driven him crazy.
DeleteMac, your phrase "constantly trying to tread the waters of life" is quite appropriate. He certainly tries; he just doesn't get anywhere. The big question to answer: Why?
DeleteGood point, Peyton! What frustrates me here is that I, personally, can understand why Willy does it (like you point out), but buy acting this way (even though he believes he is doing the right thing) he is hurting Biff and Happy. They don't grow up having the appropriate mindset to be successful -- either in Willy's definition of success or in Biff's version of happiness/success.
I think Kaiser's reply can be used as evidence and reasoning to support the idea that money most certainly DOES NOT bring happiness.
“Oh, I’d better hurry. I’ve got to get some seeds. I’ve got to get some seeds, right away. Nothing’s planted. I don’t have a thing in the ground.” -Willy (122)
ReplyDeleteIn this moment Willy has finally realized what he believes to be the one thing he can do to make everything right again. If he dies his family will be better off, however before he does that he needs to plant some seeds. This is because Willy believes he has nothing to show for his life and before he dies he needs to plant something so after his death something will come out of it. Willy feels like his life has been a waste and nothing good has come out of it but if he can put something in the ground at least he can die knowing he has something to physically show the worth of all the work he's done in life. This quote really shows the lowest point for Willy as all he can do now is desperately plant some seeds before he dies and hope they can somehow justify his entire life's worth.
This is a really good point. Willy really does want to leave some sort of impact in any way he can. This idea is carried with Willy throughout the whole text. He wants Biff to succeed because it reflects well on him. Whether it's business or the football game. He wants his boys to thrive, to carry on the Loman name in a triumphant way. If Willy leaves this Earth with nothing, he's an utter failure. But these seeds are his last effort, one final mark on the planet.
DeleteAgreed. It's saddening to know that he feels worthless and is never able to realize how much his life was worth, how much he had to show for it. It was only after he died that his livelihood was brought to light. Willy had an entire house to show for his life. 35 years of work put into that house having "put up the garage" (138) and when "he built the extra bathroom" (138). Not only the house, but those within the house. In those 35 years Willy had two sons that grew to be great men respectively. Willy never looked back on everything he did, and in doing so he never really was happy with his life accomplishments. He never recognized his accomplishments and that is the saddest thing ever.
DeleteOkay, first off, I LOVE Zach's point that Willy "never recognized his accomplishments" -- so true! He is able to do many things (as Zach points out) which in essence proves Biff's line: "He had the wrong dreams. All, all, wrong" (138).
DeleteGood choice of scene, Ben. The seeds scene is sooooo sad. Willy believes he has nothing; he has no legacy, so he needs to create something tangible and permanent (something that he can see because he doesn't see his aforementioned accomplishments).
The seeds, as Kobe mentions, are "his last effort" for "one final mark on the planet." This takes me back to Their Eyes. Remember, Tea Cake dies, but Janie brings back seeds... Essentially, it is implied that he will live on.
A line I found important was on page 95 when Bernard says to Willy "But sometimes, Willy, it's better for a man to walk away." this quote stood out to me the most because not a lot of people in the world today understand this concept, never mind the people of this specific time period. I think it shows that Bernard is well beyond his years, and has gotten to the point in his life that his successes don't overcrowd the way he sees the world. It stands out because in this moment, Willy is offered some very wise words, and looks right past them. Willy is so overly consumed with providing for his family and attempting to be successful that he will lie to his wife and degrade his children. Willy may have also disregarded this advice as a kind of defense mechanism. He sees within his life that he doesn't have much longer, as he continues to get older. At this point, walking away from something, to Willy, could be absolutely detrimental, and he is afraid of what would happen if he did. This is further proven when Charley goes on to offer Willy a job, and Willy outright refuses, even though he's been fired, saying he already has a job and doesn't need another one.
ReplyDeleteI agree with your elaboration because Willy seemingly has a lot of pride even when life hasn’t looked the best for him; which I am unsure if that is a good or bad thing. Walking away is simply not an option for him, yet he fails to realize that it is not just him in his life. It is about his wife and his two sons, about his home and his car and the refrigerator that doesn’t seem to want to work. For example, when Willy was having a discussion with Howard, he kept pushing his ideologies onto his boss, claiming that “You don’t understand this” (80) even though it was Willy that could not understand. The world works in a very cruel way, and he is not so special as to have everything he desires.
DeleteI also agree with this and have some additional input. With walking away, Willy would feel as if he has given up on everything he worked hard for which is the exact opposite of what he tells his boys to do. Willy's entire family knows that he is getting too old and needs help and this is expressed when Biff says, "He had the wrong dreams. All, all, wrong" (138). Willy was so focused on getting money and making something big out of himself that he disregarded his personal and physical needs and basically just let his own body deteriorate. This goes to show how his inflated ego and unwillingness to settle affect his everyday life. Even when people try to offer him help, Willy simply refuses because he believes that he is too good for it and is afraid that if he takes the help, he will be seen as a weak, old man. Therefore, he allows his ego to get in the way of his real needs.
DeleteI agree, Willy's focus his entire life was his vision of success. He refused to give up on that dream which could be seen as admirable but at some points it can be better to let go. On the point of his age he definitely knows the end is coming which is why he is struggling so much to have a legacy that he can leave behind. His family, his house, his job. All the things he valued in life he worked hard to obtain their maximum value. He tried to motivate his sons to become ambitious businessmen, he constantly repaired his house to make sure it was in supreme condition, and finally his job. His job was what he valued most and to be fired this suddenly was the cause for his outburst. The most valuable thing in his life was essentially just ripped away from him on the grounds that he was no longer capable. To Willy that was telling him he was already dead.
DeleteKatalina, when you state, "The world works in a very cruel way," I am immediately thinking of the article which states society is to blame, that "the societal framework has posit[ed] a wrong." This is Miller's take, of course, however it leaves us to ask if society is truly at fault here.
DeleteIn a way, I think Peyton's response to the question raised above. Perhaps, Willy's ego gets in the way? Although... one could also argue that his ego IS the product of society.
Mason's reply has me thinking that if ambition and drive to achieve one's dreams is left unchecked, then the individual will ultimately be destroyed.
Going back to Maya's comment... I just want to speak of Bernard for a second. Indeed, it does appear that Bernard is "well beyond his years." How did he get this way? I ask because we see in the text that Willy and Bernard have different perceptions of what leads to success. Does this lend itself to Bernard's success and Willy's lack of success?
I found the quote, “Pop! I’m a dime a dozen, and so are you!” (132) significant because it emphasises Biff’s frustration with Willy’s obsession of him being destined for something greater. Biff knows that he isn’t a great worker, admitting to Willy that he was filled with a high self esteem that he “could never stand taking orders from anybody,” (131) making it impossible to hold a job for long, let alone move up and become the leader. This is the first time Willy has heard this from his son, both of them have always claimed to be doing better than they are. This is all significant because it shows how tired everyone, except Willy, is of keeping up a facade of success. Despite this, Willy is in denial, which only brings more attention to his delusions of what his and his son’s life is. I believe that Willy won’t admit that all of them have failed because his son’s success is the only thing keeping him going. He worked endlessly to teach what, in his eyes, is the best way for his boys to succeed. Now, like most things in his life, his efforts are fruitless and he is left with nothing.
ReplyDeleteI disagree with this because Biff isn't "successful" in Willy's mind. I think that Willy is feeling fruitless and feels that he has nothing because he spent most of his life trying to teach his sons what success is and how to attain it, and he feels that Biff has thrown that away and gone off on his own. When they got back from the restaurant, Willy was all too willing to let Biff go and do his own thing, as was Linda. I think the hope that Biff would be something greater than Willy thinks he is is what's kept Willy going all these years, but now Willy is starting to see that what he taught isn't what Biff has followed and now has those feelings of worthlessness. I do agree, however, that the family (except Willy) is tired of trying to be something they're not, and tired of always trying to live up to Willy's (in their minds) unreasonably high expectations.
DeleteI believe that Willy is in fact tired just as the two brothers are. Biff is the only one to ever come out and tackle the lie he has been creating for the past twenty years or so. Happy continues to lie saying "well, I'm practically [the assistant buyer]" (130) as a way to make his life more successful as it is. Willy is drained. The man has gone insane reliving the past. The past where his son is nothing but potential and could still be a success. Willy cannot handle reality because it isn't what he wanted. For him to face reality would be for him to realize his son is not successful at all.
DeleteI am definitely intrigued by the discussion here.
DeleteMaya, you wrote, "I think the hope that Biff would be something greater than Willy thinks he is is what's kept Willy going all these years, but now Willy is starting to see that what he taught isn't what Biff has followed and now has those feelings of worthlessness." With this in mind, isn't it ironic, then, that in the end Willy takes his life believing that Biff will actually do great things?
I have to agree with Zach (amazing, I know! : ) about Willy being just as tired. Early on we see that he is trying to be on the road less because he can't handle the traveling any more.
Keera's quote, "“Pop! I’m a dime a dozen, and so are you!” (132) is important to note. It implies that people don't necessarily leave a significant mark on the world. I think it alludes to the idea that the "little man" is basically swallowed up by the machine that is society -- but that's just an impression that I have -- it doesn't mean you have to have the same takeaway.
Happy: "I'm gonna show you and everybody else that Willy Loman did not die in vain. He had a good dream. It's the only dream you can have--to come out number-one man. He fought it out here, and this is where I'm gonna win it for him" (138-139).
ReplyDeleteI believe that this line shows extreme significance because it represents the unconditional love Happy had for his father. Throughout his life, Willy wanted his sons to love him and be proud of him just as he was of them and this line clarifies that. In both life and death, Happy loved his father no matter what happened between them and no matter what state of consciousness his father was in. To Willy, that was one of the most important things in life and it illustrates a sense of peacefulness for Willy's death. Willy was also worried that no one would remember him, so to relieve this pressure, Happy dedicates his life to fulfilling Willy's dreams and accomplishments.
I agree with this completely, Happy has always been the son to show Willy love and respect. Additionally, from the beginning Happy has always defended his father whenever Biff wouldn't. For example, when Biff claims that his dad mocks him, Happy chimes in saying that "he's not mocking you"(21). Happy has always thought highly of his father despite the circumstances, which made him a more positive character. Biff really never respecting his father made him lack that foundation of feeling "unconditional love". Happy has always showed a sense of pride with Willy being his father, which made Willy have a peaceful death in knowing that one of his sons care.
DeleteI also agree with this. Even though both sons are filled with failure versus success, Happy was also the only son who truly defended his father and tried to understand what was going on with him. Though Willy might not deserve that form of respect for how he treated Happy growing up, he still gave him that "unconditional love" that made Willy's death a little easier in the long run.
DeleteI agree that Happy is using his devotion to Willy’s ideal life as a way to help him cope with his father’s death. However, it also highlights how obsessed Happy and Willy are with their dream of a perfect salesman’s life. Despite Willy’s final day being the result of a life wasted in a career that got him an inch from nowhere; Happy only being one of two assistants to the assistant, both have ticked themselves into thinking they have greater prospects. Where Biff is the son that saw the failings of his father and tries to grow beyond them; Happy is the son that will happily follow his father’s footsteps off a cliff.
DeletePeyton, you have offered a perspective that I have never considered -- thank you for that! Indeed, his love is "unconditional," as Zoey and Cam both clarified; yet, I still think it's necessary to consider Conner's point. Unconditional love is a beautiful thing, however, I wonder if Happy will then continue Willy's legacy of failure (of course, one would have to believe Willy has failed...)
DeleteWilly, anxiously: Oh, I'd better hurry. I’ve got to get some seeds. He starts off to the right. I’ve got to get some seeds, right away. Nothing’s planted. I don’t have a thing in the ground.
ReplyDeleteThis quote is significant because it’s the culmination of Willy’s feelings of failure. The seeds represent the inability to prove his worth. Barely being able to afford food from week to week, Willy scrambles to get seeds down in the middle of the night when no sun is around in a desperate attempt to prove that something he worked for had paid off. However since it’s both the middle of the night and in Brooklyn, the seeds do not germinate, further emphasizing Willy’s feelings of failure.
I agree with this completely. By having Willy attempt to plant a garden, show his last attempt to succeed at something during his life. Willy was especially hungry for success when Biff came home with a new found confidence. When Will hears that, he becomes angry, and "with hatred'(132), he attacks Biff. This show how much Biff, is reminded of himself until this moment. Now that his son found his identity and succeed in some degree, Will feels like it is his turn. Willy was initially angry with Biff because he knew that it was impossible to ever feel successful, due to his life being one failure after the other.
DeleteI agree with this insight that Will’s feelings of failure are ever present. Furthermore, while Willy is planting seeds Ben comes to him saying insurance fraud is “a cowardly thing”(126), however, this is Willy’s true last stab at “success.” Willy is going so far as to kill himself just to make money for his family. This illustrates the lengths Willy will go to escape the burden of failure. His life has been full of failures, yet he still wants to succeed in some way, and the last way he knows how is to die for his family’s financial needs. This also helps uncover what Willy defines as success. Although he has a loving wife and two sons, he still can not consider himself a success without being wealthy. When talking to Ben about killing himself he says, “It’s twenty thousand on the barrelhead,”(126) depicting that all he cares about is being able to support his family. Willy does not think about the emotional strain it will have on his family, he thinks they all would want him to kill himself for the money, which in itself shows how distant he was with the world all because he never succeeded in his eyes.
DeleteI like how you all interpreted the significance of the seeds. When thinking reading about Ben, I had this picture in my head with Ben (depicted as a little devil-type character) whispering in his ear, like his conscience (or, in this case, his subconscious) talking.
DeleteDuring Willy and Charley’s conversation about money, Willy says “Funny, y’know? After all the highways, and the trains, and the appointments, and the years, you end up worth more dead than alive”(98). Willy’s repeated mention of death as well as his attempts at suicide contributes to the overall sense of failure throughout the play. The only way to be successful in Willy’s eyes is to be ‘well liked’; although Willy claims to be well liked, his sales state otherwise. Failure constantly bombards Willy’s life particularly with his job. He insists on not working for Charley to maintain his pride even after he was fired. Willy is unwilling to accept that times change and being ‘well liked’ will not continue to carry him throughout his life. This idea is too difficult for him to come to terms with causing him to take his anger and frustration out on his wife and sons; ultimately leading to his family’s resentment of Willy. Despite his family repetitively advocating for him, Willy is blind to the opportunities he was given and would rather wallow in his own self pity. Later, Biff even states that Willy’s attempts at suicide were “suppose to make me [Biff] sorry for you?”(130) attempting to bring light to the irrationality Willy is swamped with. Moreover, Willy’s self deprecating humor allows for a full view into Willy’s mind and how he is too deep in misery to realize that nearly everyone he knows only wanted to help him. His failure clouded his judgement causing him to believe that all of his actions would sum short of success. This idea, so deeply rooted in his brain, only enhanced his sense of failure and assisted his oversight of the possibility of becoming free.
ReplyDelete
DeleteI agree with your point that Willy is too deep into his self pity to accept any help despite the many offerings. Along with not accepting any help, Will also refuses help from himself. This refusal to take a chance and succeed in anything but sales is shown when Willy is talking to Charley about his roof. He knows he is good with tools but refuses to believe that he could be successful with them because “a man who can’t handle tools is not a man.” (44). Not only does Willy refuse to think that being able to build things should be a common trait about men, but he degrades Charley with it. Acting as if Willy is better than him because he can build a roof. This illustrates that Willy only believes his success is in sales and not in the skills he is actually good at.
I agree, Willy’s belief that he can only attain success through sales creates a tunnel vision of failure in his life. He can’t see the opportunities given to him because he’s so stuck on this and the ideology of needing to be well liked in order to succeed. After being offered a job in Charley’s business, Willy declines by stating “I-I just can’t work for you, Charley.” (97). Willy doesn't understand how Charley can be successful without having the personality that he deems necessary for success. Therefore he can’t see himself being bound to Charley for anything other than those 50 dollars a week. His perspective on success and inability to update it lead him to his death.
DeleteI definitely don't disagree any of your connections to Willy's sense of self-pity or debilitating perspective on success -- all are valid points! I am curious, however, if anyone has any empathy or even sympathy for Willy. Should we feel bad for him? (And, this is me legitimately posing a question to think about... I think you could successfully argue either way.)
DeleteBiff: “Dad, will you give me a minute to explain?” (108), Biff :“Don’t take it that way! Goddammit!” (113). The whole discussion of Biff’s meeting with Oliver is particularly important because Biff is not given the chance to say what he needs to. He is nervous in trying to break the news to his dad and does not quite know how to do it. When the conversation begins it does not help Biff become more at ease because Willy constantly interrupts him or starts jumping to conclusions. Most of the conclusions he jumps to are bad and he is just assuming at this point that his son will let him down. Therefore, connecting back to the idea of failure. The conversation casts some more light on their father-son dynamic. Biff is constantly trying to please his father with no success. This conversation also shows how Willy and Biff never quite understand each other. There is a lack of communication between them which adds to their damaged relationship.
ReplyDeleteI agree with your points. I completely understand that this father-son dynamic is very complicated in terms of failure. Without success from his boys, Willy is at a loss because he isn't sure if he raised them properly, so even though he blames the boys on their lack of success, he's ignoring the doubt within himself. This is also shown throughout his conversations with his brother, Ben, as he knows he was not as successful as he thought Ben was at an early age. In a way, Ben was right, stating "You'll never get out of the jungle that way," because if a person is lost in their head with success and failure, it will not end well. His expectations for his sons, therefore, are far too high to reach in comparison to what Ben had accomplished, and he puts his sons down just because he's showing what he doubts within himself. This being an toxic trait, their relationship was bound to be damaged because of their lack of understanding for one another.
DeleteI agree with your point. The conflicting thoughts in Biff's mind one hundred percent backup your idea. Biff wants to tell his father that he failed but Happy tries to make him hide it. He tells Biff to lie and “tell him something nice”(105). This conflict of wanting to tell his father but then also feeling the pressure from Happy of how negatively it may affect him really weighs on Biff. With the combination of being interrupted constantly and Happy almost forcing him to keep it to himself Biff is in an impossible situation and like you said it all adds to their damaged relationship.
DeleteYes... lack of communication! That is an astute point, Gio, that I think we could add to our list of big ideas.
DeleteThis idea of communication can even be connected to Cam's points about Ben. (On a different note, I like the use of "toxic" in your response, Cam!)
To coincide with Ben's points, it's almost like Biff's internal conflict is affecting his ability to communicate effectively (though, of course, Willy and Happy don't make it very easy either...)
When Willy and Biff are having their big argument Biff says "I am not a leader of men, Willy, and neither are you. You were never anything but a hard-working drummer who landed in the ash can like the rest of them!"(132) Biff is calling out his father, who up until now has acted like a big shot, saying that he was known far and wide as a prestigious salesman. Biff recognizes that they are both just cogs in the machine of society and don't play very important roles, that no matter how hard they work they will never reach the top, and at the end of their usefulness they will be cast aside. Biff is accepting his role and trying to move on while Willy is stuck, letting his imagination change the world around him because he cannot change himself.
ReplyDeleteI agree with you because this is seen as a turning point in both of their perceptions of success. They are beginning to understand that how they perceived success as is utterly flawed. Biff understood that he wasn’t gaining success, so he accepted it and tried to move on to actually become successful, but, like you said, Willy is stuck where he is and continuing to be stubborn. Along with Willy’s stubbornness affecting his success, it also affects his relationships. This is illustrated when he’s having a conversation about being lonely with the woman, when she says, “Whyn’t you have another drink, honey, and stop being so damn self-centered” (116). Being so stubborn is affecting how he performed in his job, but also how others perceive him.
DeleteI completely agree with your point and honestly it's quite sad. It is as if Willy is completely aware of the fact that he is not a big shot but despite that he still acts to those around them like he is. He realizes his career has been a bust and in the end he hasn't gotten at all out of it what he thought he would. Willy says to Howard "They don't know me any more"(81). Yet later on when he talking to "Ben" he says "That boy will be thunder-struck, Ben, because he never realized I am known!"(126) In this instance he out loud admits that he's washed down but to himself he can't admit that and still talks himself up in his own mind. With all this being said the sad thing is that despite the fact that deep down Willy knows he is a failure he is unable to admit it to himself or those around him.
DeleteFirstly, I want to comment on the power behind Biff's words in Mason's quote of choice. Can you imagine saying something like that?!!!! Ouch. Secondly, I think it is clever to link to "cogs in the machine of society." Within the text there is a consistent implication of this idea.
DeleteI appreciate, Sarah and Ben, how you reference Willy's stubbornness; and, agree that it is "quite sad." Hypothetically speaking, I wonder: If he were to have become aware of his errors earlier in life, would he have been able to change? Honestly, I don't even feel comfortable with an answer to that question right now... it's just me thinking!
Willy: … and by the way he died the death of a salesman, in his green velvet slippers… (81)
ReplyDeleteDave Singleman’s death illustrates the dream Willy formed his life around. One where when he died, he would be remembered and known and “well liked”. A life where the work was simple, almost comfortable. Willy was sold on a lifestyle that only happens to those who are both hard-working and extraordinarily lucky. This one line depicts the terrible contrast between the idea of the American dream and the reality of it. If this play was on the life and death of Dave Singleman, it would be the story of the man that made his American dream come true and died having been known by people the world over. That was the “Death of a Salesman” that Willy was sold. The death that Willy found himself with, was born from a dream founded on luck, and sold on the empty promise that luck had nothing to do with it.
I agree with your pints because Willy did grasp onto a false hope that he passed down to his children. As Willy grappled with his parenting and questioning his skills as a parent, he was also grappling with what he viewed himself as and what he wanted for himself, and in turn his children. He ultimately wanted success, but he was fed a twisted reality of what the American Dream is in comparison to what is actually feasible. Even Charley says”A salesman is got to dream, boy. It comes with the territory” (138). This exemplifies the understanding that everyone around Willy knows that he has far-fetched dreams in relation to the American Dream, but Willy is so focused on achieving his unrealistic idea of the American Dream he can’t even acknowledge how irrational his focus is.
DeleteI agree, Willy is obsessed with how he will be remembered. It's similar to the American Dream but instead of obtaining in the moment Willy desires to have a legacy. This legacy is not only with his reputation but also with his sons, which is why he is so focused on them being successful business people. When Biff tries to find success elsewhere Willy cannot see that as feasible because his whole life he has only been focused on success in business so to him that's the only place where success could be. Dave Singleman, similar to Ben represents everything Willy wants. Dave though, represents what Willy wants in death unlike Ben, who represents what Willy wants in life.
DeleteLoving that we get to talk about the title now -- even though I still hate on how titles become lines in books! But, as we know, that's just one of many personal issues on my end! : )
DeleteWhen we look at the title of the text, we can also consider how the "death" of the "salesman" relates to the change within the job itself. The job of salesman, as Willy knows it, has changed. And, we all know how good Willy is with change, right? (sarcastic tone here)
And, of course, the title also refers to Willy's metaphorical and physical death. The beautiful thing (and often most frustrating) is that so many different meanings are implied within just one phrase or word. Remember the poem, "Cross," by Langston Hughes? Cross has multiple denotations and connotations, and Hughes plays upon all of them.
Willy: “Nothing’s planted. I don’t have a thing in the ground” (122).
ReplyDeleteThe garden symbolizes Willy’s career. He doesn’t have anything to show for his career as it was all to keep himself afloat as he went through life, not long term sustenance. This also emphasizes Willy’s materialistic obsessions, with which he associates ones’ success to. The garden has nothing to show for what he may have done in the past to it, thus a parallel to Willy’s career. Willy figuratively planted himself in sales, but never blossomed, like his garden. Wanting to get seeds illustrates Willy’s last desire to have something to show for the hard work he put into life.
This illustrates his insecurities as well. At the start of the play, Willy was insecure about his parenting, but eventually this transitioned to insecurity about his lack of tangible sense of image and reputation. Miller used Willy’s self-doubt in his parenting skills to mask his true underlying insecurity: his failure in his job.
I totally agree. In the final few scenes, Willy fumbles around and attempts to "sow the seeds of success" by quite literally sowing seeds in the backyard garden. The seeds' failure to grow quite literally represents Willy's final failure to be a success. Willy not only has to face the failure of his poor performance and work and now his firing, but he also has to deal with the failure to grow these seeds. This inability emphasizes his insecurities that he displaces into Biff.
DeleteI agree that the garden is a parallel to Willy’s career. Yet, I also think the garden just parallels Willy himself. He has come to this realization that his life is ending soon and he has nothing to show for it. This is his final shot at being successful and leaving a mark. His prior attempts have come back in his face whether it be his sons or his career. In his mind what does he have to show? He is told by Linda that “nothing’ll grow any more” (72) yet, he is hopeful he can make it work. The fact that nothing will grow also mirrors Willy because he can’t seem to take root when he tries. He attempted to raise a successful family and be extraordinary in his job but it just did not work. This adds to Willy’s insecurity about every aspect of his life. In addition, a garden also emphasizes life and growth whereas, he refutes change and has the inability to keep a life going. He never gets his garden rooted before he dies, so he was never actually settled into his life.
DeleteSarah, I really appreciate your use of word choice: "Willy figuratively planted himself in sales, but never blossomed, like his garden." You extended the metaphor well -- delightful to read!
DeleteMaking parallels between the garden and Willy AND the garden and Willy's career are also quite valid. Ryan, you also used metaphor appropriately here with the phrase "sow the seeds of success;" and, Gio, expanding the idea of the garden and change is excellent -- love the word choice of "He never gets his garden rooted."
WILLY: When this game is over, Charley, you’ll be laughing out of the other side of your face. (89)
ReplyDeleteThis line is significant because it illustrates the emphasis Willy is putting on Biff’s last game. He believes that this game will secure Biff’s future in football, he even goes so far as to claim that it “is the greatest day of [Biff’s] life.” It is later revealed that “[Biff’s] life ended after that Ebbets Field game” indicating that Willy was correct in saying it will be the greatest day of Biff’s life because after that, his life went downhill. This ties back into the significance of the quote, where Willy is bragging to Charley about his son’s success, but in reality it was the last time Biff would be one which shows how desperately Willy wants one of his sons to “make it” and live a good life unlike the one he has had.
I agree. I think the importance that Willy puts on this game sets his high expectations Willy had for Biff. Willy believes that Biff will go to the best football school in the nation and become the greatest football star the world has ever seen. However, after that game, Biff fails math and is therefore rejected from college. It's the extremely high expectations that Willy puts on Biff that drive the wedge in their relationship. While Willy just wants to see his sons succeed, the bar he sets for them is far too high, resulting in them spiting him for making them feel like failures the way he does.
DeleteI agree Willy puts a lot of emphasis on Biff’s last game, but also he emphasizes whatever his son’s are doing. He does this because he wants them to be successful and give him bragging rights. He becomes overly excited at any talk of opportunity. For example Biff’s meeting with Oliver, Willy is happy and mentions how Biff is “heading for a change” (72). However, with his overemphasis comes this very brutal criticism. Whenever his boys come up empty handed, particularly Biff, he becomes enraged. Moreover, when Biff tells him his meeting with Oliver did not go well Willy starts yelling at his son and tells him “If you hadn’t flunked you’d’ve been set by now!” blaming Biff and himself (109). Willy partially blames himself for Biff’s failure and is trying to make up his own failures in life. He does this by living through Biff. Back to the example of the football game, he continually says “it is the greatest day of his life” (89). He is putting a lot of pressure on Biff in this game because this is what is going to make him known. Willy’s prime has already passed and he considers himself a failure because he is not popular. Therefore, this drives Willy to make sure it does not happen again in the form of his sons.
DeleteI'd like to add to Kaiser's comment which reads as follows:
Delete"[Willy] believes that this game will secure Biff’s future in football, he even goes so far as to claim that it “is the greatest day of [Biff’s] life.” It is later revealed that “[Biff’s] life ended after that Ebbets Field game” indicating that Willy was correct in saying it will be the greatest day of Biff’s life because after that, his life went downhill."
What frustrates me about this ("this" meaning what occurs in the play) is that Willy's affair is what triggers Biff to change course. Biff was all set to finish the class; but... he doesn't. Enter Willy and the Woman.
Is it Willy's fault? Is it Biff's fault? Who (if anyone) is to blame?
Biff crying,broken: “Will you let me go, for Christ’s sake? Will you take that phony dream and burn it” (133)
ReplyDeleteIn the book Willy’s idea of The American Dream is connected with being prosperous through charisma. He believes that his family can achieve it all through this false image that he’s created for him and his sons. It’s gotten to the point where they can’t tell the difference between what actually happened and the lies they have told each other. Act 2 demonstrates the truth about these characters; Happy being one of two assistants to the assistant, Biff’s time in jail over theft, and Willy’s infidelity to Linda, etc. It’s not until Biff reaches “the peak of his fury”(132) that he finally obtains the ability to express himself and his true desires. He doesn’t want to follow his father’s materialistic idea of the American dream. Biff is able to acknowledge and accept the reality of their situation, they’re “a dime a dozen” (132) and no lie can’t prevent that. He seeks freedom from The American Dream and that’s why he’s so set on working in the west.
I agree that at their final two arguments one of the main concerns was how Willy has been lying to himself when it comes to almost every aspect of his life. This wall of illusionary success acting as his only defense against the reality of his families lives. It is most apparent during Willy’s outbursts when discussing the past with Bernard. Willy almost has to place blame for Biff’s apathy on anything other than the truth. He is wholly convinced it was the teacher or it was Biff himself that ruined his future, when it was the environment and the situation that biff found himself in that destroyed his enthusiasm for the future.
DeleteI agree that Biff cannot live up to his fathers expectations and that is why he becomes furious however I do not believe it is because he wants to break away from the American Dream; I believe that Biff wants to live his own American Dream. Although not the same as Willy’s, Biff’s dream still maintains the ultimate result of being successful. Willy wants Biff to be successful and Biff wants to be successful but their different views of success is the real problem. Biff’s vision of the American dream involves buying “a ranch”(23) and using “our [Happy and Biff’s] muscles”(23). While Willy’s dream, like America said “ being prosperous through charisma”. These dreams clash, they both want to succeed but their methods of success are the reason for their dispute.
DeleteI like your use of the word "charisma," America -- it's the adult version of Willy's "well-liked!" Your points also have me connecting back to Gatsby and his version of reality. Both Willy and Gatsby have issues discerning what is real and what is not.
DeleteNotice, as Conner points out, how the past filters into this text as well. Think about it... What might the play being saying about the past? About the future? What happens if we continue to live in the past?
Nice counterpoint, Tiana! You use excellent evidence to support Biff's version of the American Dream. Biff's notion of success is legit to him; but, problematically, as you stated his idea of success "clash[es]" with Willy's idea of success.
I found the part of Act 2 where Biff is crying in front of his father to be very important. Biff’s demanding that Willy let him go conveys Biff’s powerful emotions. Biff doesn’t want his father to believe in him anymore because it is crushing Biff knowing that he is disappointing his father each time he returns to the house. Willy’s optimism that Biff will still be great is too much for Biff. He so desperately wants his father to give up on him so he can finally have that reality check he needs. Biff can’t move past his weaknesses until his father, the one man he loves the most, gives up on him. If Willy gives up, then Biff’s entire life will change.
ReplyDeleteI disagree that Biff needs Willy to give up on him. Although Biff does ask his father to “let me [Biff] go, for Christ’s sake?” (133), he is upset and impulsive. Biff needs his fathers approval. When Biff first came home him and Happy were conversing about Willy. Happy said that Willy mumbles as if he is “talking to you [Biff]” (21) and Biff twice asks “what’s he say about me?” (21). He is hopeful that it is something positive that encourages him instead of depressing him. Willy is notorious for mocking Biff reminding him that he is not a success but all Biff wants is his fathers acceptance. That is the reason he hides the fact that he went to jail; he was attempting to preserve any last sense of decency his father may think about him. Biff may believe he wants his father to give up on him, but Biff needs this push, this drive, to enforce him to strive to be better. The love Biff has for his father makes him want his father to accept him, and in a time of hurting he claimed otherwise, but his thoughts and actions argue otherwise.
DeleteI agree with the importance of Biff’s crying in front of his father to be very important in Act 2 and his failures to be a result of the delusions of grandeur Willy implemented in them. When Biff is at the height of his emotions he begs Willy to “take that phony dream and burn it” (133). He understands that all the lies they told to make themselves look/feel better have given them the inability to distinguish the truth from their lies. The moment he realizes this, he gains the ability to be free from his father’s ideology of success.
DeleteInteresting discussion... I am wondering if, rather than give up on him, Biff just needs Willy to finally accept truth/reality...
DeleteAnd, (again, I am just thinking) what exactly are Biff's weaknesses? Part of me thinks that Willy views what Biff is actually good at (the ranch, working with his hands, etc.) as weakness, whereas they are actually strengths.
But, don't get me wrong -- Biff definitely has some faults!